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October 27, 2007

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Homer

Mutahir: Democracy? That is a joke, its OIL, contracts and thats it, George W can't even spell the word democracy properly, how on earth would he know what democracy means?

I'd like to point out that the Iraq invasion was also very much for the defense industry, i.e. an industry filled with greedy scum who hate big government and high taxes BUT love big lucrative no-bid contracts, i.e. those who espouse the greatness of capitalism BUT are 100% dependent on the US govt!!!


War Industry Regains Command
[snip]

Lockheed-Martin, the nation's top weapons manufacturer, reaped a 22 percent increase in profits, while rivals for the defense buck, Northrop Grumman and General Dynamics, increased profits by 62 percent and 24.7 percent, respectively. Boeing's profits jumped 61 percent, spiked this quarter by its commercial division. But Boeing's military division, like the others, has been doing very well indeed since the terrorist attacks.

fajensen

Europe and the US have forgotten their own historic experiences: That democracy cannot work in a multi-cultural society!

Democracy, IMO, is just the modern version of the tribal council of the old Viking tribes.

The fact is that Europe killed between 20% and 40% of it's population in wars and ethnic cleansing during the 16'th century. This shaped the nations along clean ethnic lines and they could then become democratic because they basically agreed over all important issues.

All-in-All it is totally naive to expect that the tribes in Iraq should do any better than the European tribes by skipping the civil war and jumping to democracy.

Adding to that, Iraq today is just some lines on the map drawn by French and Englismen a hundred years ago. Lasting borders are fought over. The US presence can postpone the fight or suppress it but eventually the US will leave and the real shaping of (a) new nation(s) along ethnic lines will begin.

Mutahir

Well, everyone knows by now atleast what the US and UK went to IRAQ for? Their was never nor their is a Threat of WMD or the So called Islamic Extremism.

Democracy? That is a joke, its OIL, contracts and thats it, George W can't even spell the word democracy properly, how on earth would he know what democracy means? Tony Blair on the other hand is the most intelligent politician of our time or the past decade or the past two decades atleast, he has secured himself a good role which would still enable him to get rich and famous simultaneously, Can Tony Blair bring any peace to Israel/Palestine Issue? NO, Never....when UNO has done nothing in Africa since its formation and neither in the Middle east peace process, how can Tony Blair do? This is all a joke to humiliate and give fake hopes to people around the world. Terror warnings, conferences, speeches ....all crap. Tony Blair in his recent visit to New York, for a conference talked about Islamic Extremism and the nation of islamic extremism is now Iran ! :) I mean, first Afghanistan, then Iraq, now Iran, lastly he appreciated on how quickly Americans are getting good command over the English Language :)
He is intelligent...!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/americas/7052080.stm

Homer

Chris Baker: In the case of the Shiite militia's and the Iranians for example, their goal is to deny Sunni's equal rights.

Not if you look at the history of the most powerful political players in Iraq Mr Baker.

Their goal is much different Mr Baker.

Right now, two groups are most powerful in Iraq: Al-Dawa and the SCIRI.

Al-Dawa and the SCIRI were founded in Iran well over twenty years ago.

Al-Dawa and the SCIRI supported Iran in the Iraq-Iran war.

Al-Dawa and the SCIRI have been fighting to transform Iraq into a fundamentalist Shiite republic for well over twnety years.

That is their goal Mr Baker.

They want the majority to rule in Iraq and the majority wants an Islamic state which is governed by Islamic law and principles.

Chris Baker

The founding principle of a democracy is equal rights. However a group may engage in terrorism, death squads and the most horrific savagery in an attempt to deny another group their equal rights.

In the case of the Shiite militia's and the Iranians for example, their goal is to deny Sunni's equal rights - although they are careful never to say it that way. In the case of the Sunni's terrorist groups it's to deny the Shiite's equal rights - although of course they never say that either.

Homer

Michael D. Allen: When president BUSH invaded IRAQ thinking that the IRAQI people would support him was something he had to believe in order to carry out this mission which was to free IRAQI people from the brutal dictator that terrorized all his people.

Would you put your hand on The Bible and swear that what you wrote above is 100% true?

Why?

Basically, what you wrote bears NO resemblance at all to the rationale that was presented by President Bush in the State of the Union prior to the inavading of Iraq in 2003.

In that speech, Iraq was portrayed as an ominous threat to the US which need to be dealt with before SH launched another 9/11 like attack.

That was the main focus.

Be honest.

Be truthful.

What you are writing about is what Bush spoke about after no WMDs were found, i.e. after the original and primary rationale turned out to be 100% wrong.

Bob Schilling

Right now it doesn't seem like Iraq has the conditions needed to support democracy. People aren't safe. What little middle class there was appears to have (sensibly) fled. There doesn't seem to be much in the way of elected local government. And, of course, the Iraqi "constitution," promulgated by the current government but essentially dictated by the Americans, doesn't contain anything like the protection of personal rights and freedoms that ours does.

I thought Republicans, calculating thought they might be, were competent at this sort of thing. What happened?

Bob Schilling

Right now it doesn't seem like Iraq has the conditions needed to support democracy. People aren't safe. What little middle class there was appears to have (sensibly) fled. There doesn't seem to be much in the way of elected local government. And, of course, the Iraqi "constitution," promulgated by the current government but essentially dictated by the Americans, doesn't contain anything like the protection of personal rights and freedoms that ours does.

I thought Republicans, calculating thought they might be, were competent at this sort of thing. What happened?

Bob Schilling

Right now it doesn't seem like Iraq has the conditions needed to support democracy. People aren't safe. What little middle class there was appears to have (sensibly) fled. There doesn't seem to be much in the way of elected local government. And, of course, the Iraqi "constitution," promulgated by the current government but essentially dictated by the Americans, doesn't contain anything like the protection of personal rights and freedoms that ours does.

I thought Republicans, calculating thought they might be, were competent at this sort of thing. What happened?

Michael D. Allen

To all who wants to listen!

America did not start as a big country. It started with people from different countries that wanted a new way of life. One with the hope that our children can go to school and grow to adulthood without the threat of violence and retribution from others. They wanted to choose their own way through life and be responsible for their actions regaurdless of race, color, creed, religion or any other labels that seperate you from everyone else!
Democracy is a frame of mind, an idea of how to accomplish the freedom everyone wants deep in their sole. The problem is democracy is not easy to accomplish when the people of IRAQ are not united in this cause. From the comments I have read it seems that each writer truly does not understand what democracy means.
When president BUSH invaded IRAQ thinking that the IRAQI people would support him was something he had to believe in order to carry out this mission which was to free IRAQI people from the brutal dictator that terrorized all his people. But the one thing he didn't plan on was that the IRAQI people are not capable of understanding what democracy is because all they have known for years is the brutal downhanded treatment they have withstood for decades. The division of all the secular parties in IRAQ will not compromise with each other. Because of this and the brutal way the different sects have delt with each other, this has divided your country deeply.
You should not blame America for trying to give your country what America has. America has gone through its own changes over the decades but all Americans from all walks of life, from many different countries and many different cultures thrive in AMERICA.
America is trying to show Iraq's people how to acomplish this monumental task but all we get in return is how bad america is and why don't we do something. Well we did dispite the whole world we tried to help.
Democracy comes from within yourself and a wish to be free from the idiologies of the rest of the world. You almost make me wish we never tried in the first place. Our on men have died for the freedom of your country and all you can say is "What is this democracy you speek of! If this is what democracy is, you can keep it!"
I'm sorry for the deaths of all the inocent people that lost their lives but when a country is so messed up that the people are fighting each other there is little hope.
I hope for IRAQ's children that your country still exists when they grow up. Maybe they can pull IRAQ out of the dark ages and get them with the rest of the world. I'm still hopefull that it will happen!

Mike Allen

A concerned American

yowzah

It's been shown over and over again that you need four things to have a good society. 1) democracy. 2) rule of law. 3) Personal freedom. 4) Private property. That's all.

ljm

The violence and killing in Iraq is not about democracy. It's a civil war and within the civil war are turf wars within sects like criminal gangs. Iraq functions more like multiple mafias at the moment. It's not a functioning democracy. The US is also functioning at the moment as a country hijacked by a mafia. We are living in really strange times.

noor

Some of forgien people think we are lucky people because we live in democratic country (the dream of every one except iraqi:democracy and freedom). we thinked that the democracy like a gift by which you can do every thing and say what do you want but today in iraq the law was destroyed ,the humen was killing by it..the democracy is born with humen inside himself as apart of his personalty and the human can`t recieve it at any time because he will use it in badly way that can harm him as happened with us ...(AL.arabiya)channle will display wanderful aprogram about democracy tommorw(sunday)at the night and is called (the democracy why??) i hope that you can see it

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